My assessment applies to what I see presented by the modern Conservative movement. My current solution is to vote as many of them out of office as I can. Conservatives are a threat to my children’s education and if they had their way would take away my ability to vote. I do not see Conservatives fighting against the racists in their ranks. I don’t think that I am mischaracterizing Conservatives.
As for the young man who wants to burn it all down, I strongly disagree with his position. I think voting can still make a difference. I do not see Conservatives creating a situation where that young man can advance. A Conservative icon is suing a venture capital group formed to provide funding for Black and Latino women. Conservatives go out of their way to make themselves my enemy. My solution is Vote.
Edit to add
DeSantis allows children to be exposed to Prager U
Conservatives are silent
The Governor of Arkansas bans AP African American studies two days before schools open
Republicans are silent
Alabama ignores a Supreme Court ruling on voting districts
Republicans are silent
The Governor of Texas puts up barbed wire to injure immigrants
I don’t disagree with your take on modern conservatives. My point is more that we need to be clear about what we are talking about. “Burn it all down” is a feeling of frustration on both sides of the political spectrum who see what others have as unfairly theirs or unearned. “I got mine” is a retreat from public discourse fueled, in my opinion, by a similar sense that our problems (maybe can but definitely) *won’t* be solved by government action. I agree on the importance of our civic voice and voting: I just also hope we will all educate ourselves about different perspectives and impacts before we do, so our vote represents both our personal but also our societal interests. Do you know what I mean?
Burn it all down makes no sense. Conservatives are the group that openly states government doesn’t work. They then run for office, obstruct and prove that government doesn’t work. The only solution is to vote for the person who is not a Conservative. Conservatives are not going to educate themselves. Conservatives want an uneducated public. What message do you have to change the Conservative mind?
Edit to add:
Kumbaya is not going to have any impact on Conservations. Liberals and Independents are the only option to avoid authoritarian government.
I am not a conservative. I am a moderate liberal (I ditched progressive as a label a few years back). Many of the Bernie supporters backed Trump because they really wanted to burn it down. So it really isn’t just conservatives. But let’s talk conservatives….
My dad was a conservative until a few years ago. It started under Obama when he saw the deep vein of racism that still ran through America. He saw the Trump movement as a throw back to a time he had actually lived through, but without the civility and personal responsibility that had shaped him. He looked on as his fellow conservatives were unwilling to embrace easy, common sense solutions to fix problems because their base was spun up into a rage fueled tizzy. As a lifetime member of the NRA, he wondered if the second amendment makes sense in America today. After seeing the way his catholic mother and baptist father fought over religion, he cringed to see our public policy be ripped from someone’s sacred book. As a supporter of Reagan in the 80s, he had to admit trickle down economics wasn’t what it was marketed to be. He read about climate change and future mass extinctions and wondered what kind of legacy he was leaving his grandchildren. He still believed that the local level is the best place to govern, but saw that local governments can be corrupted. He was a scientist though, and scientists are well practiced at reconsidering their previous positions when evidence contradicts it. I don’t think he’s alone, though many are afraid to go against their own “team” and faced with the vitriol of “the other side” why should they?
The racism and anti-education positions I see from Conservatives are deal breakers. I don’t see pointing out actual Conservative policy positions as vitriol. I previously noted that this site has posts titled”Kamala is Wrong Again”. You could literally label many posts “ What the Negroes Did Wrong Today”. There was one post asking whether Obama or a grifter like Clarence Thomas was more moral. I’m sorry, but the nonsense I see from the Conservative side does not give me hope that there can be any reconciliation until they come to their senses. I know this may seem oft putting to your father, but I think the reason that Conservatives devolved into authoritarians was precisely because they were coddled.
They wanted to lock up Hillary. The Obama’s were portrayed as animals or pimps. Goldwater and Reagan were not subtle about supporting state’s right. What we see now is the result of not calling out the racism and bigotry early on.
Your tone is dismissive and combative. If you want to actually persuade anyone, I think you need a more evenhanded tone. People who have chosen their side won’t hear you anyway, but those who might be inclined are never going to listen. I think it was Stephen Covey who said “Seek first to understand, then to be understood.” That said, feel free to yell from your internet soapbox all you want…
I really like this space. Glenn does a much better job of explaining a conservative perspective than just about anyone I’ve heard and the people who post here are mostly thoughtful people who very clearly have had different “priors” which also helps see why people hold opinions that often, on the surface, make no sense to me.
I think part of the problem is that “conservatives” used to mean something and now it means different things to different people in different contexts. It’s really hard to talk about the important issues of our time when words don’t always mean the same thing to everyone. I think it’s worth trying. But I do think it takes extra effort to explain and not just throw talking points at each other… you know what I mean?
To be honest, I am an individual expressing my own point of view. I am not trying to convince others of anything. I offer a counterpoint. I expect people to disagree with my opinion. The disagreement does not bother me. When a Conservative like DeSantis objects to an AP African American history course, but allows Prager U in elementary school, I object. How would you want me to craft a message that I find the position of the Florida department of education objectionable without offending Conservatives?
A post labeled “Kamala is Wrong Again” has a very clear message that many would find problematic. Should the post be given another title? Glenn is a contrarian. I’m sure the post was made to elicit a reaction.
My assessment applies to what I see presented by the modern Conservative movement. My current solution is to vote as many of them out of office as I can. Conservatives are a threat to my children’s education and if they had their way would take away my ability to vote. I do not see Conservatives fighting against the racists in their ranks. I don’t think that I am mischaracterizing Conservatives.
As for the young man who wants to burn it all down, I strongly disagree with his position. I think voting can still make a difference. I do not see Conservatives creating a situation where that young man can advance. A Conservative icon is suing a venture capital group formed to provide funding for Black and Latino women. Conservatives go out of their way to make themselves my enemy. My solution is Vote.
Edit to add
DeSantis allows children to be exposed to Prager U
Conservatives are silent
The Governor of Arkansas bans AP African American studies two days before schools open
Republicans are silent
Alabama ignores a Supreme Court ruling on voting districts
Republicans are silent
The Governor of Texas puts up barbed wire to injure immigrants
Republicans are silent
The list goes on and on.
I don’t disagree with your take on modern conservatives. My point is more that we need to be clear about what we are talking about. “Burn it all down” is a feeling of frustration on both sides of the political spectrum who see what others have as unfairly theirs or unearned. “I got mine” is a retreat from public discourse fueled, in my opinion, by a similar sense that our problems (maybe can but definitely) *won’t* be solved by government action. I agree on the importance of our civic voice and voting: I just also hope we will all educate ourselves about different perspectives and impacts before we do, so our vote represents both our personal but also our societal interests. Do you know what I mean?
Burn it all down makes no sense. Conservatives are the group that openly states government doesn’t work. They then run for office, obstruct and prove that government doesn’t work. The only solution is to vote for the person who is not a Conservative. Conservatives are not going to educate themselves. Conservatives want an uneducated public. What message do you have to change the Conservative mind?
Edit to add:
Kumbaya is not going to have any impact on Conservations. Liberals and Independents are the only option to avoid authoritarian government.
I am not a conservative. I am a moderate liberal (I ditched progressive as a label a few years back). Many of the Bernie supporters backed Trump because they really wanted to burn it down. So it really isn’t just conservatives. But let’s talk conservatives….
My dad was a conservative until a few years ago. It started under Obama when he saw the deep vein of racism that still ran through America. He saw the Trump movement as a throw back to a time he had actually lived through, but without the civility and personal responsibility that had shaped him. He looked on as his fellow conservatives were unwilling to embrace easy, common sense solutions to fix problems because their base was spun up into a rage fueled tizzy. As a lifetime member of the NRA, he wondered if the second amendment makes sense in America today. After seeing the way his catholic mother and baptist father fought over religion, he cringed to see our public policy be ripped from someone’s sacred book. As a supporter of Reagan in the 80s, he had to admit trickle down economics wasn’t what it was marketed to be. He read about climate change and future mass extinctions and wondered what kind of legacy he was leaving his grandchildren. He still believed that the local level is the best place to govern, but saw that local governments can be corrupted. He was a scientist though, and scientists are well practiced at reconsidering their previous positions when evidence contradicts it. I don’t think he’s alone, though many are afraid to go against their own “team” and faced with the vitriol of “the other side” why should they?
The racism and anti-education positions I see from Conservatives are deal breakers. I don’t see pointing out actual Conservative policy positions as vitriol. I previously noted that this site has posts titled”Kamala is Wrong Again”. You could literally label many posts “ What the Negroes Did Wrong Today”. There was one post asking whether Obama or a grifter like Clarence Thomas was more moral. I’m sorry, but the nonsense I see from the Conservative side does not give me hope that there can be any reconciliation until they come to their senses. I know this may seem oft putting to your father, but I think the reason that Conservatives devolved into authoritarians was precisely because they were coddled.
They wanted to lock up Hillary. The Obama’s were portrayed as animals or pimps. Goldwater and Reagan were not subtle about supporting state’s right. What we see now is the result of not calling out the racism and bigotry early on.
Edit to add:
How would you craft your message?
Your tone is dismissive and combative. If you want to actually persuade anyone, I think you need a more evenhanded tone. People who have chosen their side won’t hear you anyway, but those who might be inclined are never going to listen. I think it was Stephen Covey who said “Seek first to understand, then to be understood.” That said, feel free to yell from your internet soapbox all you want…
I really like this space. Glenn does a much better job of explaining a conservative perspective than just about anyone I’ve heard and the people who post here are mostly thoughtful people who very clearly have had different “priors” which also helps see why people hold opinions that often, on the surface, make no sense to me.
I think part of the problem is that “conservatives” used to mean something and now it means different things to different people in different contexts. It’s really hard to talk about the important issues of our time when words don’t always mean the same thing to everyone. I think it’s worth trying. But I do think it takes extra effort to explain and not just throw talking points at each other… you know what I mean?
To be honest, I am an individual expressing my own point of view. I am not trying to convince others of anything. I offer a counterpoint. I expect people to disagree with my opinion. The disagreement does not bother me. When a Conservative like DeSantis objects to an AP African American history course, but allows Prager U in elementary school, I object. How would you want me to craft a message that I find the position of the Florida department of education objectionable without offending Conservatives?
A post labeled “Kamala is Wrong Again” has a very clear message that many would find problematic. Should the post be given another title? Glenn is a contrarian. I’m sure the post was made to elicit a reaction.