I'm certainly no expert here.... but I thought that there were studies done on non-human primates (chimps?) where they gave dolls and some stereotypical boy toy (I don't recall what they were) to infants and the females showed a preference for the dolls and the males showed a preference for the stereotypical boy toy. Again, it's not "abi…
I'm certainly no expert here.... but I thought that there were studies done on non-human primates (chimps?) where they gave dolls and some stereotypical boy toy (I don't recall what they were) to infants and the females showed a preference for the dolls and the males showed a preference for the stereotypical boy toy. Again, it's not "ability", but "interest", and it seemed to show that even non-human primates show sex-related interests.
Hi Steve, I think you are right that there are behavioral differences in the average girl and the average boy starting early on. But even early on, those differences can be amplified by socialization. Even in new born babies, if you dress the baby as a girl the baby is responded to more quickly and with more compassion than if dressed in boy clothes (at least in one study I read about). In that case, it was balancing the difference that as early as 6 weeks testosterone production is believed to impact expressiveness of baby boys with the socialization idea that boys shouldn’t be rewarded for crying, as horrifying as that is. I don’t know about you, but if you are looking at 10 week old babies and having trouble sussing out what is biological and what is socialized at that point, by the time the kid reaches adulthood it’s going to be impossible.
I think people underestimate the impact of socialization. I was the kind of girl who did boy stuff, and there was always a lot of friction from that. I am sure for a person who didn’t violate gender norms, they would never have experienced that and thus feel there weren’t those strong pressures. Do you know what I mean?
Agreed. There's no single explanation. I guess I was pushing back on "it's all socialization" -- which of course you never claimed it was! We'd probably disagree some on the details, but I think we agree on the big picture.
I'm certainly no expert here.... but I thought that there were studies done on non-human primates (chimps?) where they gave dolls and some stereotypical boy toy (I don't recall what they were) to infants and the females showed a preference for the dolls and the males showed a preference for the stereotypical boy toy. Again, it's not "ability", but "interest", and it seemed to show that even non-human primates show sex-related interests.
Hi Steve, I think you are right that there are behavioral differences in the average girl and the average boy starting early on. But even early on, those differences can be amplified by socialization. Even in new born babies, if you dress the baby as a girl the baby is responded to more quickly and with more compassion than if dressed in boy clothes (at least in one study I read about). In that case, it was balancing the difference that as early as 6 weeks testosterone production is believed to impact expressiveness of baby boys with the socialization idea that boys shouldn’t be rewarded for crying, as horrifying as that is. I don’t know about you, but if you are looking at 10 week old babies and having trouble sussing out what is biological and what is socialized at that point, by the time the kid reaches adulthood it’s going to be impossible.
I think people underestimate the impact of socialization. I was the kind of girl who did boy stuff, and there was always a lot of friction from that. I am sure for a person who didn’t violate gender norms, they would never have experienced that and thus feel there weren’t those strong pressures. Do you know what I mean?
Agreed. There's no single explanation. I guess I was pushing back on "it's all socialization" -- which of course you never claimed it was! We'd probably disagree some on the details, but I think we agree on the big picture.