I visited Chicago in 1998. Coming from New Zealand I was floored by the size of the buildings. It’s sad to hear that progressive political policies are rendering this once glorious city, a shadow of its former self. As The Underground man said, “give man enough economic prosperity such that all he need do is sleep, eat cake and busy himself with the continuation of his species, then surely out of sheer ingratitude and boredom he will wreak havoc on that from which he has benefited so profoundly”
Mark, the article quoted: "degenerate savages are killing people with impunity" to which YOU assigned a Skin Tone! I don't believe that People of Color are the only people qualified for that description. So, have you allowed your preconceived ideas inform your opinion
There are a lot of WHITES qualified to be degenerate savages as well. They should not be excluded simply because of their complexion.
FYI In my neighborhood that looks like the United Nations, I am the MINORITY
I am also still looking for the White Privilege I am accused of having, Can you tell where to look for it
In this hyper PC , toxic environment we find ourselves in these days, do you really think playing the Race Card is helpful? Because it looks to me , like that is what you are doing by assuming Facts Not In Evidence or making generalizations
I don't know why more people aren't referring to the warning that Bernie Sanders gave years ago. When you go through the major metropolitan cities and encarcerate 25% of the black males for petty crimes like possession, your actions will have lasting repercussions. Women with multiple children are forced into the workplace where they cannot be there for the formative years of a child's development. They get raised by other kids. And kids are known sociopaths. If the generation of kids that were born to broken families because their fathers were incarcerated grow up without the maternal influence that teaches us empathy, they will never learn it. They will get to the point where killing has no meaning and they will be coming of age right now. When the crackdown on crime happened, the result was an entire generation of youth that lack empathy. For those who had the benefit of being raised by their grandparents, you have to remember that their grandparents were part of the civil rights movement. They carry the bitter resentment of how they were mistreated and they undoubtedly convey that to their grandchildren whom they are raising. This is a recipe for disaster and Bernie Sanders nailed it. Now, the lack of empathy and the desire for fame and fortune at any cost has been encoded into our culture and what was once perhaps survivalism is now a source of vengeful pride. The unraveling of our cities came from the short-cited response to the previous unraveling in the late 80s. To think that the answer to this problem is increased incarceration or oppressive government control will simply condemn us to repeat this process in two generations.
not to hijack, but i have a kinda related Q: how will this affect the great universities around Chicago? in particular, the U of C and Northwestern? UM did not seem to be affected by the deterioration of Detroit, though i could be wrong about that.
I grew up in Waukegan in the 1970s, a lovely town that Ray Bradbury memorialized as "Green Town" in so many of his stories. It was idyllic. We could play in the ravine in Bowen Park, be gone all day and our parents never worried. I guess those days are gone.
Hello Dr. Loury, and kudos again on a good podcast. I've been a Chicago area resident since 1974 (south side, Oak Park, south suburbs) and currently teach at UChicago. The decline on the south side (I see it every time I drive to the university) is substantial and heartbreaking. Even in the last ten years, blocks that were formerly busy with people on the street, business patrons, etc., are now quiet. Perhaps some of that is the residual of the pandemic (Chicago has been VERY slow to re-open, unlike its suburbs), but there is a lot of anxiety and fear out there. The Hyde Park neighborhood on the lake, home of the university, similarly has become more anxious and fearful even as the university commits to more policing and more investing into its own controlled properties.
An anecdote about the university: two murders in Hyde Park, one a student on the street and the other a recent graduate in the parking deck of a posh lakeside residential tower, completely killed off the "student"-led "Defund the Police" movement on the campus. After the second murder the University upped the university-paid police presence even more, and there wasn't a single complaint about brutality. It's a small but clear illustration of when confronted with a choice, safety versus morality, most people will pick safety.
Will people support the harsh measures needed to turn this around? Not yet..they haven't been traumatized enough. Trauma is the only true agent of change.
It is a shame that Dems won't admit they are failing to secure safety for the people they claim they represent. I worked in Detroit and watched the Dems destroy her, inch by terrible inch with their greed and graft-ridden departments. If Dems would only admit their dishonesty, their greed, their gimme more, gimme more attitudes! Am I a Dem - sort of. Am I ashamed of being a Dem - pretty much;-( Dang! I'm voting Republican this time around and I'm 80 years old!
I do wonder if Chicago is the major “middleman” of drug distribution throughout the Midwest. The amount of money available to bribe, directly and indirectly, is huge. Chicago has always had major organized crime problems. Of course, I do not live there and know very little about the city first hand.
So, one can have true traditional crime, while the criminal organizations use the propaganda of politics to advance their cause. It might even work in both directions.
Our country as a whole seems to have been moving toward a nihilism that feels unstoppable. We have lost the concepts of good and evil——to a large extent. I would like to see the GOP have a huge win in 2022 and 2024——as much as a test as a belief it would be better.
Then again, I also think this could be all illusion. Really, nothing has changed. Maybe things are worse than 20 years ago, but not worse than 100 years ago.
Any casual observer of history knows this. If I have a “bottom line”—-it would be something like “we talk too much on social media and believe what we say is true”——-when it’s just noise filled with sound and fury, but signifying nothing.
We can talk about gun violence ad nauseam but the root cause isn't really addressed. It isn't poverty, though I am sure it is a significant contributing factor. It is the selfish, narcissistic perception that the lives of others is meaningless. Children and young adults wield death without a thought. There is no sense of right and wrong, simply wounded egos and the thought that killing the offender is justified. If an individual wants they feel they can take. The lack of fear of criminal prosecution plays a part but if there is no concept of guilt, shame or remorse about violent crime. There are at least two generations raised on the concept of only "self" matters. Life is not sacred. Others are meaningless. Without somehow changing this perception can violence be reduced. Strong families who impart a sense of duty and responsibility to their children, respect for others and a work ethic that implies you can succeed, you can improve your life without violence and crime will end this cycle. But right now our society is assailed by messages of hopelessness (apocalyptic global warming, systemic racism, a rigged financial system . . . ) create hopelessness. This mania is reflected in a myriad of ways but violent crime is the most obvious.
Chicago already died and you just can’t admit. Lightfoot and Fox are evidence. They and the Democratic Party optimized the destruction of Chicago and blacks in particular by their policies and practices around abortion, bail, defund police, lack of arrests/prosecutions/incarcerations for black on black violent crime (murder, rape, robbery, assaults, carjackings, etc). So Chitown, you kinda deserve what you voted for.
Cities have been abandoned and are becoming uninhabitable across the country.
Almost always because of criminal violence attendant to the drug wars.
Law and Order is needed everywhere and it is a crisis.
Instead of abandoning cities we should take drastic action.
1. Destroy the drug marketplace that is enriching the Drug Market Terrorist Leadership.
Government treatment for people who want to buy drugs should be available for all. Any drug desired should be provided. Heroin, Cocaine, Opioids, etc. and substitutes should be available at no cost.
Drug addicts are committing slow motion suicide, terrorizing our communities and killing innocent bystanders. Lets give addicts the option to recover or die based on their own free choice.
2. Reform the justice system beginning with "juvenile justice".
Secret trials, secret resolution, secret records. This information belongs to the public, not to the government and it should be public.
The kid who killed 29 of his classmates in FL is now awaiting his sentence - it might be death.
All juvenile crime records should be public and all juvenile criminals should be sentenced to residential trade schools and should not be released until they master a trade and prove that they can support themselves and live unsupervised in a community.
If we don't reform city living we need to learn how to thrive in rural settings.
Malicious truth of life #1: you get more of what you tolerate. When the elected and appointed can enact policies that harm people and still keep their jobs, they have no incentive to change. And like the Martha's Vineyard crowd, the people who keep supporting this political class will not get it even if the problem lands in their backyard. In the former case, the left kept trying to accuse DeSantis of using a political stunt instead of recognizing the issue of illegal immigration. And so it appears with the latter. Crime is out of control, the SAFE-T law is coming, yet the odds of the perpetrators being re-elected are probably better than average.
I visited Chicago in 1998. Coming from New Zealand I was floored by the size of the buildings. It’s sad to hear that progressive political policies are rendering this once glorious city, a shadow of its former self. As The Underground man said, “give man enough economic prosperity such that all he need do is sleep, eat cake and busy himself with the continuation of his species, then surely out of sheer ingratitude and boredom he will wreak havoc on that from which he has benefited so profoundly”
Mark, the article quoted: "degenerate savages are killing people with impunity" to which YOU assigned a Skin Tone! I don't believe that People of Color are the only people qualified for that description. So, have you allowed your preconceived ideas inform your opinion
There are a lot of WHITES qualified to be degenerate savages as well. They should not be excluded simply because of their complexion.
FYI In my neighborhood that looks like the United Nations, I am the MINORITY
I am also still looking for the White Privilege I am accused of having, Can you tell where to look for it
In this hyper PC , toxic environment we find ourselves in these days, do you really think playing the Race Card is helpful? Because it looks to me , like that is what you are doing by assuming Facts Not In Evidence or making generalizations
IMHO Mike
I don't know why more people aren't referring to the warning that Bernie Sanders gave years ago. When you go through the major metropolitan cities and encarcerate 25% of the black males for petty crimes like possession, your actions will have lasting repercussions. Women with multiple children are forced into the workplace where they cannot be there for the formative years of a child's development. They get raised by other kids. And kids are known sociopaths. If the generation of kids that were born to broken families because their fathers were incarcerated grow up without the maternal influence that teaches us empathy, they will never learn it. They will get to the point where killing has no meaning and they will be coming of age right now. When the crackdown on crime happened, the result was an entire generation of youth that lack empathy. For those who had the benefit of being raised by their grandparents, you have to remember that their grandparents were part of the civil rights movement. They carry the bitter resentment of how they were mistreated and they undoubtedly convey that to their grandchildren whom they are raising. This is a recipe for disaster and Bernie Sanders nailed it. Now, the lack of empathy and the desire for fame and fortune at any cost has been encoded into our culture and what was once perhaps survivalism is now a source of vengeful pride. The unraveling of our cities came from the short-cited response to the previous unraveling in the late 80s. To think that the answer to this problem is increased incarceration or oppressive government control will simply condemn us to repeat this process in two generations.
Well.
Bye
not to hijack, but i have a kinda related Q: how will this affect the great universities around Chicago? in particular, the U of C and Northwestern? UM did not seem to be affected by the deterioration of Detroit, though i could be wrong about that.
Lay off Detroit...
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5aOWZSzxEEA
I grew up in Waukegan in the 1970s, a lovely town that Ray Bradbury memorialized as "Green Town" in so many of his stories. It was idyllic. We could play in the ravine in Bowen Park, be gone all day and our parents never worried. I guess those days are gone.
Hello Dr. Loury, and kudos again on a good podcast. I've been a Chicago area resident since 1974 (south side, Oak Park, south suburbs) and currently teach at UChicago. The decline on the south side (I see it every time I drive to the university) is substantial and heartbreaking. Even in the last ten years, blocks that were formerly busy with people on the street, business patrons, etc., are now quiet. Perhaps some of that is the residual of the pandemic (Chicago has been VERY slow to re-open, unlike its suburbs), but there is a lot of anxiety and fear out there. The Hyde Park neighborhood on the lake, home of the university, similarly has become more anxious and fearful even as the university commits to more policing and more investing into its own controlled properties.
An anecdote about the university: two murders in Hyde Park, one a student on the street and the other a recent graduate in the parking deck of a posh lakeside residential tower, completely killed off the "student"-led "Defund the Police" movement on the campus. After the second murder the University upped the university-paid police presence even more, and there wasn't a single complaint about brutality. It's a small but clear illustration of when confronted with a choice, safety versus morality, most people will pick safety.
Again, kudos.
Will people support the harsh measures needed to turn this around? Not yet..they haven't been traumatized enough. Trauma is the only true agent of change.
Oh, I see you don't post anything that even seems 'anti-Dem? Too bad
It is a shame that Dems won't admit they are failing to secure safety for the people they claim they represent. I worked in Detroit and watched the Dems destroy her, inch by terrible inch with their greed and graft-ridden departments. If Dems would only admit their dishonesty, their greed, their gimme more, gimme more attitudes! Am I a Dem - sort of. Am I ashamed of being a Dem - pretty much;-( Dang! I'm voting Republican this time around and I'm 80 years old!
I do wonder if Chicago is the major “middleman” of drug distribution throughout the Midwest. The amount of money available to bribe, directly and indirectly, is huge. Chicago has always had major organized crime problems. Of course, I do not live there and know very little about the city first hand.
So, one can have true traditional crime, while the criminal organizations use the propaganda of politics to advance their cause. It might even work in both directions.
Our country as a whole seems to have been moving toward a nihilism that feels unstoppable. We have lost the concepts of good and evil——to a large extent. I would like to see the GOP have a huge win in 2022 and 2024——as much as a test as a belief it would be better.
Then again, I also think this could be all illusion. Really, nothing has changed. Maybe things are worse than 20 years ago, but not worse than 100 years ago.
Any casual observer of history knows this. If I have a “bottom line”—-it would be something like “we talk too much on social media and believe what we say is true”——-when it’s just noise filled with sound and fury, but signifying nothing.
We can talk about gun violence ad nauseam but the root cause isn't really addressed. It isn't poverty, though I am sure it is a significant contributing factor. It is the selfish, narcissistic perception that the lives of others is meaningless. Children and young adults wield death without a thought. There is no sense of right and wrong, simply wounded egos and the thought that killing the offender is justified. If an individual wants they feel they can take. The lack of fear of criminal prosecution plays a part but if there is no concept of guilt, shame or remorse about violent crime. There are at least two generations raised on the concept of only "self" matters. Life is not sacred. Others are meaningless. Without somehow changing this perception can violence be reduced. Strong families who impart a sense of duty and responsibility to their children, respect for others and a work ethic that implies you can succeed, you can improve your life without violence and crime will end this cycle. But right now our society is assailed by messages of hopelessness (apocalyptic global warming, systemic racism, a rigged financial system . . . ) create hopelessness. This mania is reflected in a myriad of ways but violent crime is the most obvious.
Chicago already died and you just can’t admit. Lightfoot and Fox are evidence. They and the Democratic Party optimized the destruction of Chicago and blacks in particular by their policies and practices around abortion, bail, defund police, lack of arrests/prosecutions/incarcerations for black on black violent crime (murder, rape, robbery, assaults, carjackings, etc). So Chitown, you kinda deserve what you voted for.
Cities have been abandoned and are becoming uninhabitable across the country.
Almost always because of criminal violence attendant to the drug wars.
Law and Order is needed everywhere and it is a crisis.
Instead of abandoning cities we should take drastic action.
1. Destroy the drug marketplace that is enriching the Drug Market Terrorist Leadership.
Government treatment for people who want to buy drugs should be available for all. Any drug desired should be provided. Heroin, Cocaine, Opioids, etc. and substitutes should be available at no cost.
Drug addicts are committing slow motion suicide, terrorizing our communities and killing innocent bystanders. Lets give addicts the option to recover or die based on their own free choice.
2. Reform the justice system beginning with "juvenile justice".
Secret trials, secret resolution, secret records. This information belongs to the public, not to the government and it should be public.
The kid who killed 29 of his classmates in FL is now awaiting his sentence - it might be death.
All juvenile crime records should be public and all juvenile criminals should be sentenced to residential trade schools and should not be released until they master a trade and prove that they can support themselves and live unsupervised in a community.
If we don't reform city living we need to learn how to thrive in rural settings.
Malicious truth of life #1: you get more of what you tolerate. When the elected and appointed can enact policies that harm people and still keep their jobs, they have no incentive to change. And like the Martha's Vineyard crowd, the people who keep supporting this political class will not get it even if the problem lands in their backyard. In the former case, the left kept trying to accuse DeSantis of using a political stunt instead of recognizing the issue of illegal immigration. And so it appears with the latter. Crime is out of control, the SAFE-T law is coming, yet the odds of the perpetrators being re-elected are probably better than average.