I very much appreciated the discussion about your fathers and families. I am in the federal civil service and I am one of the keen genealogists in my family, and the whole discussion resonated with me deeply. I would say more, but I think I would end up talking far too much about myself and be far to tangential to the content. Thank you for your thoughtful and informative discussions. I look forward to them.
I’ll look for it, it was the Paul Rossi bit and I remember liking the use of the word “fidelity” in that sequence. In my opinion, you were basically blueprinting the kafkatraps these educational administrators/institutions are manufacturing to justify their own terms, and rebuke the heretics.
12:43 to 14:51.... Johns reaction/response to the subject and then Glenn's characterization.... I think it is a great clip. Covering "The Bigotry of Low Expectations" and "This shit has to go" Very powerful to hear two black men make these no nonsense, factual assertions in such a tremendously calm, confident way.
I signed up for the free month on Fox Nation to watch your interview. I felt that Tucker allowed you to speak freely which made it such a pleasant conversation to hear. I'm glad that it was a positive experience for you. Look forward to seeing the rest of your work.
Many of the issues brought up about people meeting standards remind me of civil service reform in the late 19th century. Teddie Roosevelt said that he had been criticized for supporting civil service reform because it was (according to his critics) against the lower class and against Irish in particular. Civil service reform required that applicants were required to pass a test before being hired for a position. Previously a person got these positions by working for a political party and meeting people. Then the people were appointed by political leaders. The argument against civil service reform was that the old way was democratic because anyone could work hard for a political party, and they did not need a lot of education to do so whereas better educated people were more able to pass the civil service exams. Modern complaints about entrance requirements for elite high schools or elite universities have some similarity to this.
Glenn, there are annoying technical problems. If I post a comment or try to bring up the comments while watching your video, it shuts down the video. Is there a way to continue to watch the video while reading comments or posting comments. Perhaps this is a problem with substack, and it's beyond your control.
There are some problems with modern translations of ancient Greek works, and there is some advantage to having students learn ancient Greek. One well known example is in The Apology of Socrates. During the sentencing phase, Plato indicates that the jury became angry because Socrates spoke eloquently (according to the common translation). That does not make a lot of sense, and it's because the translation is wrong. The translator used the meaning of the words from Homer's time. A translation using Greek from Socrates' time would be that the jury became angry because Socrates was bragging, which makes much more sense.
There is a similar example from biblical sources. Bart Ehrman (who teaches several Great Courses on biblical studies and who teaches at North Carolina) said that he used to believe a literal interpretation of the bible. He said that after learning to read the new testament in the original Greek, he found out that a literal interpretation could not possibly be true.
The problem of translation is an interesting one, and once you start swinging that sword you eventually realize it has two edges... For example, isn't there something to hearing the blues in the original? Or are we saying that the Rolling Stones or Led Zeppelin translations (which are very fine indeed) are all the World needs?
7:04 - Race and Classics. Like McWhorter, I am also a linguistic nerd. But unlike McWhorter, I am not professionally trained, merely an amateur hobbiest. I disagree with Glenn (but maybe Glenn was acting as devil’s advocate). For classics at one of the nation’s most elite universities, Greek and Latin is critical. I have or had up to 5 copies of the Koran (unrevised since Mohammed), and each has different words. I read it cover to cover years ago. I actually have a question about the chorus in Medea and I imagine that the original text would inform a more reliable answer.
I love hearing Glenn's simple suggestion that we as blacks should simply cultivate our potential and excel at these tests. That we be insulted at the notion the bar must be lowered for us to excel. This is a challenge to the black middle class that must be met or we will be forever dependent on the charity of other Americans to succeed. Thank you, Glenn and John.
I'm excited to watch this. I'd also be interested in hearing your takes on the North Korean defector who came out and compared Columbia University to her former country. Is she being hyperbolic for personal gain or does she really believe what she says?
I love the way Glenn “plays the Devil’s advocate”, aka “steel-manning” the opposing argument. His comparison of classics with economics was brilliant! I studied Latin in high school, and took many courses in classics as a college undergraduate, most of which were taught using texts in translation, and my world view broadened and was immensely enriched. This was way back in the 70’s. John’s in-context opposition to Princeton’s “reform” I understand and support, but the truth of the matter is that the HUGE majority of Americans, myself included, of whatever color are linguistically challenged, and I think it would GREATLY benefit all of us to examine the foundational texts of our civilization, even in translation.
Glenn, I enjoyed hearing about your father. Sounds like he had his head screwed on right, at least in the way it takes (took) to succeed in America. The kick in the ass he gave you when you dropped out of college may have been the best thing that happened to you.
A good discussion. Any attempt in Princeton or elsewhere to lower standards or reduce the rigour of academic requirements in any field under the auspices of combating 'White supremacy' must be challenged and defeated. It is unfortunate that the woke believers are doing this in the name of helping Blacks but they are doing the exact opposite! Blacks can take a cue from other minority groups like Jews and Asians that exceeded 'White' standards like SAT imposed on them. When the bar is set high, go higher. Nobody complains and asks for standards to be lowered when Black athletes and sportsmen and sportswomen break records.
I fault the public school education system -- that I have seen and know about in NYC.
Some years ago, principals were telling teachers that they should not correct their students' papers because it will hurt their egos. I worked in an adult night school program in the classroom that was used by a middle school class in the daytime. I was horrified to see papers that students printed (they had stopped teaching cursive writing supposedly because that would bore Kids) and the papers were full of basic mistakes in spelling, grammar, etc. They were hung up uncorrected with comments by the teacher of "Good", "Good job," etc. There was the racism of failing to correct many of the students in the public schools -- because they had to be coddled and had to stroke their egos because they had so many problems outside, or they assumed so. The racism of low expectations. This starts in the early years of education so it's no wonder they may take criticism as racist because they were not challenged. Sane thing with discipline and setting consequences for unruly behavior. They started ending that in more and more public schools, so kids who were trying to concentrate couldn't and the ones who were out of hand were allowed to be out of hand. These are among thee reasons there are long waiting lists of Black and Latin parents wanting their kids to get seats in charter schools. Other Blacks look for scholarships in private schools. It would be good to get stories of Black & Latin families who are trying to escape the regular public school system.
I very much appreciated the discussion about your fathers and families. I am in the federal civil service and I am one of the keen genealogists in my family, and the whole discussion resonated with me deeply. I would say more, but I think I would end up talking far too much about myself and be far to tangential to the content. Thank you for your thoughtful and informative discussions. I look forward to them.
I’ll look for it, it was the Paul Rossi bit and I remember liking the use of the word “fidelity” in that sequence. In my opinion, you were basically blueprinting the kafkatraps these educational administrators/institutions are manufacturing to justify their own terms, and rebuke the heretics.
12:43 to 14:51.... Johns reaction/response to the subject and then Glenn's characterization.... I think it is a great clip. Covering "The Bigotry of Low Expectations" and "This shit has to go" Very powerful to hear two black men make these no nonsense, factual assertions in such a tremendously calm, confident way.
I signed up for the free month on Fox Nation to watch your interview. I felt that Tucker allowed you to speak freely which made it such a pleasant conversation to hear. I'm glad that it was a positive experience for you. Look forward to seeing the rest of your work.
Many of the issues brought up about people meeting standards remind me of civil service reform in the late 19th century. Teddie Roosevelt said that he had been criticized for supporting civil service reform because it was (according to his critics) against the lower class and against Irish in particular. Civil service reform required that applicants were required to pass a test before being hired for a position. Previously a person got these positions by working for a political party and meeting people. Then the people were appointed by political leaders. The argument against civil service reform was that the old way was democratic because anyone could work hard for a political party, and they did not need a lot of education to do so whereas better educated people were more able to pass the civil service exams. Modern complaints about entrance requirements for elite high schools or elite universities have some similarity to this.
Glenn, there are annoying technical problems. If I post a comment or try to bring up the comments while watching your video, it shuts down the video. Is there a way to continue to watch the video while reading comments or posting comments. Perhaps this is a problem with substack, and it's beyond your control.
There are some problems with modern translations of ancient Greek works, and there is some advantage to having students learn ancient Greek. One well known example is in The Apology of Socrates. During the sentencing phase, Plato indicates that the jury became angry because Socrates spoke eloquently (according to the common translation). That does not make a lot of sense, and it's because the translation is wrong. The translator used the meaning of the words from Homer's time. A translation using Greek from Socrates' time would be that the jury became angry because Socrates was bragging, which makes much more sense.
There is a similar example from biblical sources. Bart Ehrman (who teaches several Great Courses on biblical studies and who teaches at North Carolina) said that he used to believe a literal interpretation of the bible. He said that after learning to read the new testament in the original Greek, he found out that a literal interpretation could not possibly be true.
The problem of translation is an interesting one, and once you start swinging that sword you eventually realize it has two edges... For example, isn't there something to hearing the blues in the original? Or are we saying that the Rolling Stones or Led Zeppelin translations (which are very fine indeed) are all the World needs?
7:04 - Race and Classics. Like McWhorter, I am also a linguistic nerd. But unlike McWhorter, I am not professionally trained, merely an amateur hobbiest. I disagree with Glenn (but maybe Glenn was acting as devil’s advocate). For classics at one of the nation’s most elite universities, Greek and Latin is critical. I have or had up to 5 copies of the Koran (unrevised since Mohammed), and each has different words. I read it cover to cover years ago. I actually have a question about the chorus in Medea and I imagine that the original text would inform a more reliable answer.
I love hearing Glenn's simple suggestion that we as blacks should simply cultivate our potential and excel at these tests. That we be insulted at the notion the bar must be lowered for us to excel. This is a challenge to the black middle class that must be met or we will be forever dependent on the charity of other Americans to succeed. Thank you, Glenn and John.
https://youtu.be/SoEfWoDbMCA?t=1027
I'm excited to watch this. I'd also be interested in hearing your takes on the North Korean defector who came out and compared Columbia University to her former country. Is she being hyperbolic for personal gain or does she really believe what she says?
I loved hearing about your family backgrounds. Thanks for sharing those stories.
I love the way Glenn “plays the Devil’s advocate”, aka “steel-manning” the opposing argument. His comparison of classics with economics was brilliant! I studied Latin in high school, and took many courses in classics as a college undergraduate, most of which were taught using texts in translation, and my world view broadened and was immensely enriched. This was way back in the 70’s. John’s in-context opposition to Princeton’s “reform” I understand and support, but the truth of the matter is that the HUGE majority of Americans, myself included, of whatever color are linguistically challenged, and I think it would GREATLY benefit all of us to examine the foundational texts of our civilization, even in translation.
Glenn, I enjoyed hearing about your father. Sounds like he had his head screwed on right, at least in the way it takes (took) to succeed in America. The kick in the ass he gave you when you dropped out of college may have been the best thing that happened to you.
A good discussion. Any attempt in Princeton or elsewhere to lower standards or reduce the rigour of academic requirements in any field under the auspices of combating 'White supremacy' must be challenged and defeated. It is unfortunate that the woke believers are doing this in the name of helping Blacks but they are doing the exact opposite! Blacks can take a cue from other minority groups like Jews and Asians that exceeded 'White' standards like SAT imposed on them. When the bar is set high, go higher. Nobody complains and asks for standards to be lowered when Black athletes and sportsmen and sportswomen break records.
I fault the public school education system -- that I have seen and know about in NYC.
Some years ago, principals were telling teachers that they should not correct their students' papers because it will hurt their egos. I worked in an adult night school program in the classroom that was used by a middle school class in the daytime. I was horrified to see papers that students printed (they had stopped teaching cursive writing supposedly because that would bore Kids) and the papers were full of basic mistakes in spelling, grammar, etc. They were hung up uncorrected with comments by the teacher of "Good", "Good job," etc. There was the racism of failing to correct many of the students in the public schools -- because they had to be coddled and had to stroke their egos because they had so many problems outside, or they assumed so. The racism of low expectations. This starts in the early years of education so it's no wonder they may take criticism as racist because they were not challenged. Sane thing with discipline and setting consequences for unruly behavior. They started ending that in more and more public schools, so kids who were trying to concentrate couldn't and the ones who were out of hand were allowed to be out of hand. These are among thee reasons there are long waiting lists of Black and Latin parents wanting their kids to get seats in charter schools. Other Blacks look for scholarships in private schools. It would be good to get stories of Black & Latin families who are trying to escape the regular public school system.