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Doug's avatar

Ok. Here’s the deal. From a Jew. Most of us (excluding the Norm Finkelstein and Aaron Mate types) don’t care what any of you people say or think. We certainly don’t care what Glenn or Rajiv have to say about this . We are not going back to the gas chambers. Period! Never again means never again. You can all f’ off.

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Yan Shen's avatar

Numerous commenters on this Substack have tried to justify the deportation of Mahmoud Khalil on the basis of his actions, even though as I understand he was a spokesperson for CUAD and not necessarily someone who was personally involved in commandeering school buildings and preventing Jewish students from getting to class. In fact, as Glenn Greenwald has pointed out, Khalil was chosen to be the spokesperson for the group precisely because he was considered to be a voice of moderation and someone able to communicate among the different parties involved.

To recapitulate what I stated in a prior comment, what's happening to Mahmoud Khalil should deeply concern all patriotic Americans. As reported by outlets like the NYT and The Free Press, the US government is essentially conceding that Khahlil committed no crimes, but is instead attempting to use an obscure statute from the Immigration Act of 1952 that allows the Secretary of State to deport any non-citizen deemed to be acting contrary to the national security and foreign policy interests of the United States. In effect, the argument is that Khalil was promoting anti-Semitism and the US government has a foreign policy interest in combating such anti-Semitism around the globe. The irony is that the original intent of this statute was in part to target radical Jewish leftists deemed to be Communist sympathizers during the 1950s. How many people gleefully cheering on the deportation of Mahmoud Khalil realize that the American government is using a law with actual anti-Semitic origins to target a pro-Palestinian protester?

Sadly the situation has gotten even worse. Apparently ICE just detained a Turkish doctoral student using the same legal pretext described above, even though as has currently been reported, her crime wasn't even to engage in excessive protests, but rather to co-author an editorial in the Tufts Daily criticizing the university's response to student demands that Tufts acknowledge the circumstances on the ground in Gaza and divest from Israel.

https://www.nytimes.com/2025/03/26/us/ice-tufts-student-detained-rumeysa-ozturk.html

Perhaps more information will come to light regarding Ms. Ozturk, but what's been reported so far is deeply concerning. The Trump administration is now attempting to make it a thought crime for non-citizens to criticize Israel. To all the pro-Israel commenters on this blog, we know you guys were never serious about free speech. Deep down, you always wanted to criminalize any criticism of Israel, just like how radical BLM activists during the George Floyd riots wanted to criminalize any criticism of Black culture as racism.

I pray that the judicial system prevents the current madness from actualizing, but it's pretty obvious that the Israel First types in this country have managed to co-opt the current administration into carrying out their bidding. They're going after non-citizens now, but don't be surprised when they become emboldened enough to come after American citizens as well, especially if you're Muslim or non-white.

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Robert Redd's avatar

Agree, people should have due process. In some instances people in civilian gear show up with handcuffs to put people into unmarked vans. We are complying with a police state.

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Luis Bermudez's avatar

I know so very little about what's going at Columbia University. I know marginally more about the history of Jews and injustice. However, I do know this: I have never seen a semitic Jew crying antisemitism. Why do academics that so enjoy strutting their mastery of lexicon allow Jews to get away with this so goddamn always? Semite is a word with a definition; a definition I see almost no Jews fit.

Will an honest, open conversation ever be had? Currently, there isn't a shred of evidence that it will.

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publius_x's avatar

What would happen to a Columbia student proudly flying the stars and bars on a dorm room door? Would that get the same treatment as a flag of “Palestine” or a Pride flag? This is about consistency in campus enforcement of policy related to community building. That people suddenly think that the unofficial flag of the PLO is anodyne but the confederate flag is racist… only means that some minorities have more respect than others on campus. And that is institutionalized antisemitism in a nutshell.

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Eric Lindemann's avatar

It's interesting that at the time of the founding of the State of Israel in 1947-1948 the international left was largely pro-Zionist. By "left" I'm talking about communists, socialists, and anti-colonialists of various stripes -- not liberals. Stalin viewed the new state of Israel as a potential Soviet ally because most of the Zionists were themselves socialists and communists. In fact, Israel was able to win the 1948 war thanks to weapons supplied by Czechoslovakia, no doubt with support from Stalin, in defiance of a UK and US arms embargo.

By 1967 the international left had flipped and had become strongly anti-Zionist. This flip has nothing to do with the treatment of Palestinians by Israel from 48-67. The Palestinians were part of Jordan and Egypt during this period. The 180 degree flip is because, as the Cold War developed, Israel allied with the US and the Arab States allied with the USSR.

Kwame Ture and Angela Davis obviously didn't cause leftwing anti-Zionism. They are examples of it circa 1970. Ture may have gotten it from the Pan-Africanists in Guinea-Bissau and Davis was probably following the CPUSA line. Interestingly the Socialist Workers Party of America which has published The Militant since 1928 is staunchly pro-Israel. This is a Trotskyist party which was obviously quite critical of the USSR and so, unlike most of the left, never flipped to anti-Zionism after the Pan Arab Nationalists, backed by the USSR, were defeated in the 1967 war. To make matters more complicated, the Chinese communists under Mao were also anti-Zionist even though they had become enemies of the USSR. The Black Panthers, who were anti-Zionist, were probably more influenced by Mao than by the USSR.

The international left is anti-Zionist largely as a byproduct of the Cold War. That was the case in 1970 and, with the exception of some errant Trotskyists, it is still true today. When X-Studies departments formed in American Universities in the late 1970s they were formed by left-wingers who shared the general left-wing anti-Zionist view pushed by the USSR and China. The only thing that has changed is that the X-Studies departments are more numerous and more powerful today than in 1970, and are also allied with Islamist students from the Middle East. This is the source of University anti-Zionism. The war in Gaza and the reaction at American Universities is just the most recent and possibly the most extreme manifestation of an old left-wing ideology. Of course, student demonstrators are not aware that they are spouting old Soviet or Chinese propaganda. The professors are not aware of it either. But that doesn't change the history.

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OCP's avatar

Couple of points. First,truck maven notes that antisemitic attacks on campiis are way up, and I don’t doubt the count, but the source is imcludimg both clearly illegal behavior, attacks, harrasment etc. and protected activity, protests and resolutions, both lumped together.

Second, while non citizens in this country do have first amendment rights those rights are not coextensive with citizens first amendment rights. There are cases from the 50’s allowing the government to deny entry to foreign communists based upon their speech. And more recently you have campaign finance cases, where foreign nationals are absolutely prohibited from making campaign contributions. And campaign finance law is analyzed under the first amendment.

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Truck maven's avatar

https://www.adl.org/resources/report/anti-israel-activism-us-campuses-2023-2024 Here is the full report. To clarify: I am always for free speech, marches, etc. I'm only concerned about the physical damage to college campuses. Anything peaceful is fine with me. March, wave signs, say anything you like, dress any way you like, and shout to your heart's content. Just don't injure people and damage property. I'm guessing that chaos causes more people to be against the protestors' goals.

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Eric Lindemann's avatar

After "Black Power", one of Stokely Carmichael's favorite slogans circa 1970 was "The Only Good Zionist is a Dead Zionist". At the time Carmichael had decamped to Guinea-Bissau, a military dictatorship backed by the USSR. The USSR was also the main military backer of Nasser and the Pan Arab movement, that suffered a massive defeat in the 1967 war. To get back at Israel the USSR launched a large propaganda campaign. All the tropes we hear on University campuses today -- Zionism=Oppression=Racism=Facism=Imperialism=Apartheid -- were part of this campaign. Much of the Soviet literature reads like The Protocols of the Elders of Zion except with the word Zionist substituted for Jew. The USSR pumped this propaganda through all of its leftwing channels -- the European Communist Parties, CPUSA (e.g. Angela Davis), Indian and Asian Communist Parties, etc. Read Izabella Tabarovsky's article on this https://www.tabletmag.com/sections/arts-letters/articles/zombie-anti-zionism. The Anti-Zionist dogma has been a standard component of the left since this time, and the leftwing professors in the X-Studies departments of American Universities inherited this. The USSR propaganda always insisted that Anti-Zionism is not the same as Anti-Semitism. Even so, the policies they implemented after 1967 included forbidding Soviet Jews from entering certain professions and Universities proving that, in fact, much of Anti-Zionism is, in fact, Anti-Semitism. This is why the adoption of the IHRA definition of Anti-Semitism which calls out certain types of Anti-Zionsim as Anti-Semitism is important. The leftwing professors today are the students of the students of anti-Vietnam war activists, radical feminists, Black Panthers who went into Academia in the 60's and 70's. The professors today are probably themselves unaware of this history. Understanding this 60 year history is essential to understanding the obsessive focus on Anti-Zionism in Universities today.

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Robert Redd's avatar

It is no surprise that Russia tries to influence United States opinion is not a surprise. The contortion used to connect the Civil Rights movement to ills of American life is disappointing. Martin Luther King Jr was called a communist despite the fact that he viewed Communism as the only serious threat to Christianity.

https://kinginstitute.stanford.edu/communism

Kwame Ture was a Pan-Africanist who criticized Communists. Francis Fukuyama ties the rise of white supremacist movements to the gains of the Civil Rights movement. The obliteration of thriving Black towns and the rise of the Klan obviously preceded King. Ture is linked to anti-Semitism. The default is always “Blame the Black guy”..

Despite the strong Leftist and Black Panther influence on Black college campuses, they remained quiet regarding Gaza.

BTW, protesting about Gaza does not make one an anti-Semite. However Black people who spoke out against Israel have been punished. Marc Lamont Hill was fired from Temple. AIPAC poured in money to oust Jamal Bowman and Cori Bush from the House. Ta-Nehisi Coates was criticized for writing about his experience in Palestine.

College students of today are likely getting their message about Gaza from what they see on television screens. They are reading books like the late President Jimmy Carter’ “Palestine: Peace Not Apartheid” and the lectures and writings of Norman Finkelstein. Don’t drag Black people into the mix.

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Robert Redd's avatar

I haven’t thought about Kwame Ture for a longtime. It seems he separated Judaism from Zionism. For him, Judaism was a religion that originated in Africa like Christianity and Islam. Zionism was a political movement.

Ture had no fondness for the white Liberal.

https://radicaldiscipleship.net/2024/02/26/the-pitfalls-of-liberalism/

The protests at college campuses was due to the War in Gaza. Protests on white campuses may have been violent. Despite your boogeymen of Angela Davis, Kwame Ture, etc., Black college protests involving Gaza, like the one at Morehouse were peaceful.

https://www.npr.org/2024/05/17/1251946460/biden-is-set-for-the-morehouse-graduation-students-are-divided

Muslims told Blacks to mind their own business in the 2024 elections and were gleeful when she lost.

https://youtube.com/shorts/I8byTnKJC1U?feature=shared

Edit to add:

You throw everything Black against the wall and say it caused anti-Semitism

Kwame Ture and Angela Davis caused anti-Semitism even though Columbia had a history of anti-Semitism dating back to the 1920s. Jewish quotas at Columbia didn’t end until the 1960s.

BTW, Ture was a Pan-Africanist, not a communist. Pan-Africans were not full throated supporters of Russia. Russia was not a colonial threat compared to the West.

https://dwomowale.medium.com/the-historical-relationship-between-africa-and-russia-4450b1756361

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Colin Reese's avatar

Way to have two non-Jews declare not much antisemitism at Columbia where Muslims openly harass Jews.

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Mark Sussman's avatar

You don't have to be Jewish to have an opinion about this.

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Colin Reese's avatar

I think it’s hilarious that two people think the antisemitism isn’t that bad when the people cross-check you to the ground if you try to walk by.

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Yan Shen's avatar

I'm not any kind of expert on anti-Semitism and I certainly don't condone disruptive campus behavior like taking over buildings or preventing other students from getting to class. But to be fair, this kind of bad behavior isn't anything new. I remember back in the day left wing students at Berkeley forming human chains to prevent white students from getting to class. I don't recall anyone advocating for mass deportations then. Even Mike Cernovich, although supportive of the Trump administration's attempts to deport Mahmoud Khalil, conceded that Khalil was only being targeted because of his anti-Israel views.

https://x.com/Cernovich/status/1899497603450261789

"Yeah. Look, I get it. A lot of people are defending the guy because we all know he's only under fire for opposing Israel. He could have said, "Kill all white Americans," and be fine."

My personal impression is that to the extent that anti-Semitism is a real problem in this country, it's probably a bigger issue among far right white nationalist types than among Muslims, as epitomized by the Tree of Life shooting back in the 2018 and also by the Charlottesville protestors carrying tiki torches at the Unite the Right rally and chanting about how Jews will not replace us.

Personally I've always found it interesting that one can openly fantasize about killing white people in America, as Yale lecturer Aruna Khilanani did back in 2021, and no one bats an eye, but apparently the US government now has a foreign policy interest in combating anti-Semitism around the world. As I stated earlier, I certainly don't condone any form of bigotry, whether it's anti-Semitism, Sinophobia, Islamophobia or just plain hatred towards entire races like Blacks or whites. However to suggest that the US government has a foreign policy interest in rooting out one very specific type of bigotry strikes me as absurd.

https://www.nytimes.com/2021/06/06/nyregion/yale-psychiatrist-aruna-khilanani.html

Heterodox Americans have long viewed the racial carveout for Black American aggrievement in the 21st century with a certain amount of skepticism, even while acknowledging the historical reality of anti-Black racism in this country. Likewise, I'm glad to see that gentiles like Tucker Carlson are also starting to wake up to the unquestioned carveout that Israel gets in our modern day discourse, even while acknowledging the historical reality of anti-Semitism around the world.

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Truck maven's avatar

Just some information from https://www.adl.org I'm not pro-Isreal particularly, have always been sympathetic to Arabs since I lived in Arab country. But I do think comments should include some data on the subject. Here's the info: "The 2023-2024 ADL annual report on anti-Israel activism on U.S. campuses tallied 2,637 anti-Israel incidents of assault, vandalism, harassment, protests/actions and divestment resolutions between June 1, 2023, and May 31, 2024, a staggering 628% increase in those categories compared to the same period in 2022-2023. This marks the highest number ever documented by ADL."

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