Not certain if I am allowed to jump back into the forum or not. However if I am as I didn’t finish complete thoughts on the matter, I would love to add to the dialogue that I am whispers of a sort of end to black thought period. Appears that the tide has turned and there’s this feeling that the need for a separate black ideology on most anything is not valued like it once was. Makes me wonder just what we are up to in the 30 or so cities across the United States where approximately 100,000 persons or more black and brown people reside. We all know those cities names because they tend to sport, no pun intended, those sports we spend an awful lot of time and energy pushing our young people into. Say nothing about whether they achieve a college degree or dare say make it those arenas period.
Yeah gentleman whom I so admire your tackling tough stuff. I am certain you know though that you won’t win many supporters for broaching the subject either.
Black Americans are absolutely being held back by this grievance race grifting ideology. An entire generation has been indoctrinated into this perspective and it will have serious negative consequences for them and the nation as a whole. We are already seeing it’s fruit on the streets nightly. It is sad to see so many black skinned citizens doing this to their fellow citizens. I can’t fathom going through life thinking this way. It is a dead end.
Of COURSE "1619" is seen as "revisionism" by anyone who had accepted and internalized prior sanitized accounts of American History which described slaves as "happy darkies" glad to toil for the white overseer who would bludgeon them into near unconsciousness for slacking or questioning their inhuman treatment, and showed the lovely tea parties hosted by Miss Anne, wife of the plantation owner, in the Big House parlor while said "happy darkies" toiled. That is precisely why "1619" is the breath of fresh air that it is: It exposes the inhuman side of early America that most are tooo embarrassed about to face head-on and come to grips with because it violates & mocks both our Founding Documents and the foundations of our national religion of Christianity. That fairy tale long called "history" DESERVES to be called out for the travesty it is, distortions and all. "1619" does that. So no wonder its critics (including the sitting governors of Florida & Virginia) cannot countenance it: It is too damning, too revelatory, too precise in its documented indictments to be ignored or dismissed.
Your choice: Tell the WHOLE story, not just the prettified version that flatters white America; or shut up. That former, censored version no longer applies. It is exposed as hogwash. Just as the movies "Roots" and "12 Years A Slave" opened the door to truth, and to the dismantling of the white-written fairy tale of US history, so "1619" continues that mission to sweep away the fictions and assert the unvarnished realities long covered up by those ashamed of it, yet who have benefit from it through the generations, & still do, at the expense of slaves long dead, but whose progeny walk among us.
That's the whole truth, perfectly stated. My grandfather was an immigrant; I don't think I have a single ancestor who was in this country before the early 1900s. And yet, I never had any difficulty viewing George Washington as the father of my country or understanding that American History from the Indians to the Mayflower to the Civil War (and everything that caused it) is as much a part of my history as the day my grandfather got off the boat.
You are no doubt correct there. But would you want to revert to African Medicine in place of modern Western Medicine? At least it would solve the overpopulation problem. Maternal and neonatal death would skyrocket, life expectancy would drop to 40 or so. Et Voilà, overpopulation and climate change solved in on fell swoop. Or the Chinese could release an even more deadly virus.
I think we should have a Left-Handed People Heritage Month!. I would bet there are almost as many lefties as Blacks and there is a tremendous prejudice against lefties. For instance: butter knives, pencils, pencil sharpeners, and in the old days pay telephones.
"We should have classes about black history...but treating it as something wholly distinct from American history will merely keep us locked into the very damaging and deluded narratives that we ought to be working to rewrite."
All well and good--save for the reality that we have an American left determined to preserve tribalism as one of their principal sources of power. Which is why we have "Black History Month" in the first place, AND the "LGBT History Month," both of which are celebrated in February, soon to be followed by "Women's History Month in March, "Asian Pacific American Heritage Month" in May, "Hispanic Heritage Month" from Sept. 15-Oct. 15 and "Native American Heritage Month" in November.
You can’t have it both ways - “call us out and make us special - wait - don’t make us special” I am guessing a goodly percentage of Americans don’t give a damn and are just getting on with their own lives.
Of course, always left out of the discussion is that we are "celebrating" the 10% of our population who probably are descended from people who were slaves in the U.S. at some point in the past. An additional 3% of our population is also Black, but they are descendants of immigrants who came here voluntarily after 1865.
Hi, I got that phish too. Decided not to bother Glenn as it was likely a fraud.
If I have a conversation with somebody younger than myself about behaviour, ethics etc, the biggest and easiest trump card they can play is to say that I am "judging" others (and implicitly, them). I reply by saying that judging is a virtuous thing to do because it entails process, structure, evidence gathering, dialogue, openness and careful decision making. It is not about typologies, it is about in-depth consideration of specific circumstances and reviewing of arguments and contingencies before arriving at ... a judgement.
This goes straight over their heads. For them "judging" is a hasty and unfair assessment of another person based on age, gender, race or other superficial features. THE BIG IRONY. This is exactly what they do to people who are not of their age, gender, race or opinion. "Old, white men, yuck".
How did this come about? I am not sure but it entailed a disregard for things which separate the rule of law from chaos. It was a power grab and if forms the basis of other assumptions which now are considered sacrosanct by McWhorter's "elect" and blindly applied by opinion formers and the gauleiter of the contemporary ethics police in organizations and pressure groups. Weinstein was guilty, judged and convicted so by the system of law and due process. This does not mean that every man who looks remotely like him is guilty of whatever you might choose to accuse him of. Just as not every black man is guilty of something just because he is driving a car.
If we do not escape this mindset, we are all screwed. That way lies fascism and ruin, not diversity equity and inclusion.
I agree with John 100%. As a white electrical engineer, I am flummoxed by the lack of history about black people like me, those who worked for a degree in engineering and went on to a fulfilling career in engineering.
As for Glenn's comment to get rid of Black Studies altogether, that won't happen as research tends to specialization. There will always be Black Studies as there are historians who study Latvians.
Not certain if I am allowed to jump back into the forum or not. However if I am as I didn’t finish complete thoughts on the matter, I would love to add to the dialogue that I am whispers of a sort of end to black thought period. Appears that the tide has turned and there’s this feeling that the need for a separate black ideology on most anything is not valued like it once was. Makes me wonder just what we are up to in the 30 or so cities across the United States where approximately 100,000 persons or more black and brown people reside. We all know those cities names because they tend to sport, no pun intended, those sports we spend an awful lot of time and energy pushing our young people into. Say nothing about whether they achieve a college degree or dare say make it those arenas period.
Yeah gentleman whom I so admire your tackling tough stuff. I am certain you know though that you won’t win many supporters for broaching the subject either.
Black Americans are absolutely being held back by this grievance race grifting ideology. An entire generation has been indoctrinated into this perspective and it will have serious negative consequences for them and the nation as a whole. We are already seeing it’s fruit on the streets nightly. It is sad to see so many black skinned citizens doing this to their fellow citizens. I can’t fathom going through life thinking this way. It is a dead end.
Thinking that incomplete history can be debunked by fictional history is irrational.
Of COURSE "1619" is seen as "revisionism" by anyone who had accepted and internalized prior sanitized accounts of American History which described slaves as "happy darkies" glad to toil for the white overseer who would bludgeon them into near unconsciousness for slacking or questioning their inhuman treatment, and showed the lovely tea parties hosted by Miss Anne, wife of the plantation owner, in the Big House parlor while said "happy darkies" toiled. That is precisely why "1619" is the breath of fresh air that it is: It exposes the inhuman side of early America that most are tooo embarrassed about to face head-on and come to grips with because it violates & mocks both our Founding Documents and the foundations of our national religion of Christianity. That fairy tale long called "history" DESERVES to be called out for the travesty it is, distortions and all. "1619" does that. So no wonder its critics (including the sitting governors of Florida & Virginia) cannot countenance it: It is too damning, too revelatory, too precise in its documented indictments to be ignored or dismissed.
Your choice: Tell the WHOLE story, not just the prettified version that flatters white America; or shut up. That former, censored version no longer applies. It is exposed as hogwash. Just as the movies "Roots" and "12 Years A Slave" opened the door to truth, and to the dismantling of the white-written fairy tale of US history, so "1619" continues that mission to sweep away the fictions and assert the unvarnished realities long covered up by those ashamed of it, yet who have benefit from it through the generations, & still do, at the expense of slaves long dead, but whose progeny walk among us.
"It’s part of a larger American story."
That's the whole truth, perfectly stated. My grandfather was an immigrant; I don't think I have a single ancestor who was in this country before the early 1900s. And yet, I never had any difficulty viewing George Washington as the father of my country or understanding that American History from the Indians to the Mayflower to the Civil War (and everything that caused it) is as much a part of my history as the day my grandfather got off the boat.
All these blaNK history months. Just fill in the blanks. What irks me most is Pride month. Who cares?
You are no doubt correct there. But would you want to revert to African Medicine in place of modern Western Medicine? At least it would solve the overpopulation problem. Maternal and neonatal death would skyrocket, life expectancy would drop to 40 or so. Et Voilà, overpopulation and climate change solved in on fell swoop. Or the Chinese could release an even more deadly virus.
I think we should have a Left-Handed People Heritage Month!. I would bet there are almost as many lefties as Blacks and there is a tremendous prejudice against lefties. For instance: butter knives, pencils, pencil sharpeners, and in the old days pay telephones.
"We should have classes about black history...but treating it as something wholly distinct from American history will merely keep us locked into the very damaging and deluded narratives that we ought to be working to rewrite."
All well and good--save for the reality that we have an American left determined to preserve tribalism as one of their principal sources of power. Which is why we have "Black History Month" in the first place, AND the "LGBT History Month," both of which are celebrated in February, soon to be followed by "Women's History Month in March, "Asian Pacific American Heritage Month" in May, "Hispanic Heritage Month" from Sept. 15-Oct. 15 and "Native American Heritage Month" in November.
If you did "White History" it would take one heck of a lot longer that a Month.
You can’t have it both ways - “call us out and make us special - wait - don’t make us special” I am guessing a goodly percentage of Americans don’t give a damn and are just getting on with their own lives.
Of course, always left out of the discussion is that we are "celebrating" the 10% of our population who probably are descended from people who were slaves in the U.S. at some point in the past. An additional 3% of our population is also Black, but they are descendants of immigrants who came here voluntarily after 1865.
Hi, I got that phish too. Decided not to bother Glenn as it was likely a fraud.
If I have a conversation with somebody younger than myself about behaviour, ethics etc, the biggest and easiest trump card they can play is to say that I am "judging" others (and implicitly, them). I reply by saying that judging is a virtuous thing to do because it entails process, structure, evidence gathering, dialogue, openness and careful decision making. It is not about typologies, it is about in-depth consideration of specific circumstances and reviewing of arguments and contingencies before arriving at ... a judgement.
This goes straight over their heads. For them "judging" is a hasty and unfair assessment of another person based on age, gender, race or other superficial features. THE BIG IRONY. This is exactly what they do to people who are not of their age, gender, race or opinion. "Old, white men, yuck".
How did this come about? I am not sure but it entailed a disregard for things which separate the rule of law from chaos. It was a power grab and if forms the basis of other assumptions which now are considered sacrosanct by McWhorter's "elect" and blindly applied by opinion formers and the gauleiter of the contemporary ethics police in organizations and pressure groups. Weinstein was guilty, judged and convicted so by the system of law and due process. This does not mean that every man who looks remotely like him is guilty of whatever you might choose to accuse him of. Just as not every black man is guilty of something just because he is driving a car.
If we do not escape this mindset, we are all screwed. That way lies fascism and ruin, not diversity equity and inclusion.
Heads up.
I received two of these in my inbox this a.m.
If this is spam or phishing the substack authors need to be aware. I have never received anything like this before.
“GIenn Loury replied to a comment on What's the Point of Black History Month?.
Good Tidings! Let’s converse㈩𝟏𝟗𝟎𝟗𝟖𝟑𝟒𝟒𝟓𝟔𝟗”
I agree with John 100%. As a white electrical engineer, I am flummoxed by the lack of history about black people like me, those who worked for a degree in engineering and went on to a fulfilling career in engineering.
As for Glenn's comment to get rid of Black Studies altogether, that won't happen as research tends to specialization. There will always be Black Studies as there are historians who study Latvians.